There is a horrible vicious nastiness at the heart of how men view women, and some days I like to pretend I don't understand it. But the truth is, most days I just look away instead of acknowledging that I understand it.

Men are afraid of penetration and humiliation, of loss of status and hardness, of permeability, of the world entering into them and changing them. This is why I used to be so scared of vampires and zombi es, monsters that overwhelm your sense of self and leave something else in its place, who leave you mindlessly desperate to be entered, by blood, by flesh.

Follow

Men fear becoming one with the masses, and so they create Fascism, to turn the masses into a weapon, to see themselves as dictators controlling the masses, never realizing that they have simply exchanged the power of unity and solidarity for the exploitation of the Mob. Each fascist is a dictator in his heart, an individual, strongly resisting a changing world.

ยท 2 ยท 7 ยท 14

Men fear ebbs and flows, they fear change. Pregnancy is a man's greatest fear, the possibility that his body could nurture another, become bent on someone else's survival, that his fundamental selfishness could literally be robbed from him.

gruesome violence 

@MoMartin one of the many reasons why alien works so well as a horror movie!

gruesome violence 

re: gruesome violence 

re: gruesome violence 

re: gruesome violence 

re: gruesome violence 

gruesome violence 

@MoMartin Never have I read a view of men that more clearly makes me see how agender I am.

@wlonk I definitely cross over into gender essentialism when I talk about this stuff, and I need to knock it off.

@MoMartin I don't take you to be saying "this is absolutely and always true", but "these are patterns and trends". Maybe that's because I'm reading more charitably than the general internet would though?

@wlonk well, in any case, thanks for reading it that way. And yes, I do mean them as trends and patterns that we have bought into and locked into, and not as prescriptive definitions.

@MoMartin

I understand what you're driving at here, but the equating of "Not bearing children" with *selfishness* makes me kind of twitchy. I chose never to have children, accepting that's one accusation I'd have to face repeatedly. But I'm still glad I stuck to my decision.

@MoMartin

I guess you can argue that a pregnant *body* is set up to support the life growing inside it. But organs and tissue don't have their own consciousness & feelings. So that doesn't account for the multitude of reasons one might have for having a baby. And those *can* be rooted in selfishness, too. Though they don't *have* to be.

@MoMartin

There's also the societal contradiction in which a parent can fight positive mass change politically or in a workplace: their rationalization being that their own child, or their own family unit, deserves protection above all others. :( (And I know from bitter experience with what passes for "feminism" in this country: that ain't just coming from cis dudes.)

@xenophora I agree with all this, sorry for the wording being imprecise. Sometimes I go for an effect, and in doing so, shore up toxic ideas that have deep resonances. Gotta work on that

@MoMartin

:) Same.

Like I said, I do get your larger points. I'm glad we can talk about this stuff more. โ˜•

@xenophora I think if I wanted to specify what I was trying to say, I would acknowledge that the values I assign to pregnancy are not inherent to it or to the bodies that can go through it, but rather, are part of the male fantasy of what pregnancy is, and why they fear it

@MoMartin

I think there's envy mixed in there, too. Much of it rooted in the fiction that it's easy and not dangerous to give birth, and that the world rolls out a red carpet for you when you do it. (Which, yeah... maybe in some societies you get to be a stand-in goddess, but in this one not so much. Unless you're mega-rich, of course.)

@amphetamine The urge to control, to be the center, to be the head? No, it's not masculine, it's universal. It comes from the essential loneliness, it comes from saying "If I could make you all an extension of me, then I wouldn't be alone." But in Men, it is compounded by the need to not become anyone else, to never reflect someone back at themselves

@Cathymarinara @MoMartin maybe in the sense that nuclear and other patriarchal family structures isolate and atrophy it, but i think that oppression for the most part only intensifies this behavior as a reaction in women, a la adrienne rich's "women and honor"

@Cathymarinara @MoMartin it's mostly about lesbians but the relevant points are:

- collectivist cultural affordances like whisper networks/gossip/lies against power are remedies oppressed classes develop
- these affordances remain even once men are not present in an interpersonal situation (e.g. primarily/entirely woman groups, lesbian relationships)

@Cathymarinara @MoMartin

- we depend on these affordances until they become maladaptive coping mechanisms overexpressed under stress (social manipulation to satisfy a need for control, and so on)

@Cathymarinara @MoMartin

it covers a lot of ground so don't let me speak for it. here's an excerpt:

Women have been forced to lie, for survival, to men. How to unlearn this among other women?

โ€œWomen have always lied to each otherโ€
โ€œWomen have always whispered the truth to each otherโ€

Both of these axioms are true.

โ€œWomen have always been divided against each other.โ€
โ€œWomen have always been in secret collusion.โ€

Both of these axioms are true.

@Cathymarinara @MoMartin

In the struggle for survival we tell lies. To bosses, to prison guards, the police, men who have power over us, who legally own us and our children, lovers who need us as proof of their manhood.

There is a danger run by all powerless people: that we forget we are lying, or that lying becomes a weapon we carry over into relationships with people who do not have power over us.

Sign in to participate in the conversation
Social @ PV

The social network of the future: No ads, no corporate surveillance, ethical design, and decentralization! Own your data with Mastodon!