Yes, white people, you actually have to put some honest work into making sure the fedi does not become a haven for bigots.

The core of the problem isn't that the fedi has hateful people. They are always going too be around.

The problem is that people that are in a position to help with the issue usually don't and just choose to hide.

That's how intolerance and hate perpetuates itself. It exploits the gap of indifference.

We can be better. The question is why don't we.

I always kind of chuckle at the fatalism of white 'progressives' when they come into contact with the pervasiveness with bigotry.

No, it's not the end of the world. Very far from it in fact. Marginalized and oppressed people have been doing this work for a very long time.

You just have to actually back up what you say with action rather than cute words that impress your friends at brunch.

If more people got in the game, it would be easier from everyone.

It really comes down to the idea of people wanting a better place.

Do you want an inclusive, diverse and safe space or do you just want to replicate the experience of other social media platforms with the social groups you are comfortable with?

If you want a better place, you're going to have to fight for it. It's not going to just happen because you have a few Black and/or trans friends in your follow list.

You have to show up for the ideals you profess. Consistently. Again and again.

I'm an optimist because these fools have been trying to take me out since I discovered online spaces and they haven't. They can't. They've tried everything from threats to harassment to attacking organizations I've woken with, etc.

At the end of the day, I _know_ I'm just stronger than they are. I am winning by the simple fact I am still existing in a place of competence, happiness and not dictated by fear.

And we can all get to that place. We just gotta try harder.

We are stronger, beloveds. If we weren't, they're wouldn't be so much effort into trying to keep us apart.

What we are building here has never been done before. It threatens traditional power dynamics in ways that absolutely terrify them because the didn't anticipate it.

Yes, they are going to push back. That's the nature of conflict. They are going to try and stop us. It's what they do.

But they can't. They can only slow down process that we are making.

Keep pushing. We're gonna be fine.


> The problem is that people that are in a position to help with the issue

what is your idea here? just want to know what you're talking about i.e. in what situation would a person on the fedi be in a position to help with the issue?

@unsuspicious Dealing with hate online is the same dealing with hate in one's everyday life.

Either you give space for it to live, or you don't.

In the particular type of intolerance we see in most online spaces, it generally orignates in social groups that identify as white.

Ergo, white people are in the best position to stem the growth of hate, but usually choose not too for whatever reason.

Which enables said hate to continue.

@Are0h @unsuspicious "Shallow understanding from people of good will is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection."

white people who will denounce bigotry when they're preaching to the choir, but avert their gaze and stay quiet when bigotry happens in front of them. white people who are willing to let someone else take a beating instead of stepping in and stopping a fist from striking.

@modgethanc @unsuspicious And that is how racism, sexism, homophobia, etc remains as a mainstay in our communities.

That's how they win. People that profess themselves to be progressives generally do nothing at all.

@Are0h @unsuspicious yeah. when bigotry is only challenged by the targets of bigotry, nothing changes. bigotry can only be dismantled when everyone in the community stands together to reject it, regardless of if they are specifically being targeted.

@modgethanc @Are0h @unsuspicious

I want to say I get the best results challenging bigots when the victims aren't in the space. It tells the bigots that my opposition is not performative, that their attitudes really are unacceptable even in private.

I *want* to say that.

But all I really know is that they stop doing it around *me.*

When hordes of non-victims challenge them, they stop doing it around everyone.

@modgethanc @Are0h @unsuspicious This is why racists get so stressed when nonblack people and especially white people challenge bigotry. Their whole schtick is to divide and conquer, and when people stop buying that bullshit their power is diminished.


@Are0h @unsuspicious

Sure. It seems like an obvious take - we all, regardless by anything - eject and reject bigotry.

However, perhaps it's worth while to recall the harshly dark reality, in which bigotry has yet to have never Ever been AFAIK so called Dismantled?

@Are0h @unsuspicious this is not a new problem; marginalized folks have always had to endure hatred and abuse while their "allies" hang back on the sidelines, too afraid or unwilling to speak up or act to stop it. it's frustrating and demoralizing every single time it happens. it makes promises of 'support' into totally empty statements because they're still not willing to help call out bad behavior or provide negative consequences to bad actors.

@Are0h so are we talking about a white person reading some kind of racist statement another white person wrote? and then the thing to do would be to call it out for what it is and somehow throwing that person out of the space? or trying to persuade the originator of the statement?

@unsuspicious Those particular decisions are up to the individual decide.

The point is to reduce the harm that is caused to the targets of bigots.

@Are0h what would reduce the harm? just asking for your opinion from individual to individual ;) not having to read it or seeing that people try to persuade the bigoted person to question their views?

@unsuspicious You just gave two suggestions and I said either of them are valid as long as they reduce harm.

You have to decide what works best for you as an individual, but the point is to do something rather than just a letting it slide.

@unsuspicious @Are0h whatever happens that isn't basically "silently letting those sorts of comments slide".

@Are0h @unsuspicious in a recent episode of "This American Life" Ira Glass interviewed an elderly woman in NYC who admitted, after some gentle persuasion, that racial bias was very much still happening in her community. After describing the history of "white flight", she said: 'if a neighbor rented to a black person, that would be frowned upon, but to a gay person, that would be ok'. She described #gentrification so well.

@Are0h it also involves standing up for people you don’t much like normally to an extent. We must fight for diversity, variety, and liberty, in our speech, in our lives


If they weren't able to take you out of online spaces though they tried everything, what makes you think it's possible to take them out?


I mean, one ot the reasons they were not able to take you out is your personal fortitude, but the main reason is that the tools are designed to protect against censorship.
So, if they use the same tools, how do you consider they can be taken out of the fediverse?

@LienRag You need to read what I’m saying instead of making up your own conclusions.

I have no interest in discussing a thought that you have completely fabricated.

Enjoy your day.

@Are0h Ok i'm new here ... what is Fedi ? ( sorry i'm bad at this )

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